tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post545247587801459524..comments2024-03-06T03:58:39.540-06:00Comments on The Viral Garden: Getting individuals excited while trying to create a communityMack Collierhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02723628321171539590noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-314147352910599962008-06-17T15:12:00.000-05:002008-06-17T15:12:00.000-05:00The question that teases me after reading all the ...The question that teases me after reading all the talk on this subject, is : what did the people who thought about this Karma system really have in mind when they implemented it? What is the intention behind the karma yo-yo?<BR/><BR/>- Is it "people oriented"? ...simply targeting fun, or satisfaction?<BR/><BR/>- Is it "community oriented"? ...targeting WOM, or to enhance conversation?<BR/><BR/>- Is it "Plurk" oriented? ...targeting human attraction to any kind of scoring/ranking system, or a smart tool to help the system grow?<BR/><BR/>As you said Mack, there is no 'one-size-fits-all' answer. From a very personal point of view, I think that (human) value can't be quantified by a ranking system. I think "karma" is an inappropriate word as by definition it is linked to "action" and so... more to what people actually DO (rather to what they say). I definitely don't see it as "points" that may be given and or taken back. <BR/><BR/>This said, Plurk is a fantastic, human, conversation platform and I very much hope that with time, people will be driving it with their eyes off the K-counter.Luc Debaisieuxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10740832981700278638noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-9596384312833096242008-06-17T13:41:00.000-05:002008-06-17T13:41:00.000-05:00That’s a great question. Totally depends on what P...That’s a great question. Totally depends on what Plurk’s goal is. If it’s all about number of user accounts and frequency of use, then the A-Team may have no problems placing emphasis on quantity instead of quality. If it’s all about creating a site with rich conversations, then hopefully the A-Team will listen to feedback and concerns from fine folks like yourself.<BR/><BR/>One potential fix would be to receive rewards from other users based on the perceptions about the value I add to the conversation. You’d have to spend some time designing how to work that out, but there are numerous ways to develop that from a tactical standpoint. Users would probably be more purposeful in their posts if they knew their rewards were tied directly to the value it shares.<BR/><BR/>The example you shared is a great example of ridiculous karma abuse and showcases the problem spot on. That’s why tying any incentive or reward program directly back to your goals is important at the outset. Otherwise, you could lose those people that bring the most to the table and contribute positively to your site’s reputation.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for sharing!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-43861248640233228362008-06-17T13:10:00.000-05:002008-06-17T13:10:00.000-05:00I agree that the Plurk karma system may have value...I agree that the Plurk karma system may have value in the sense that it gets people involved beyond just lurking, and even maybe joining in conversations that they otherwise might not have. Perhaps the way for the Plurkbuddies to handle it, is not in whether a plurk is rewarded by additional comments (sometimes, you miss plurks) or by number of plurks started, but by putting more emphasis on discussion and participation in and among threads. (I have no idea how they'd figure that out though.) And like Frank, I agree it should drop when negativity, rudeness and snarkiness ensues. (Again, no idea how they'd figure that out either.) <BR/>As usual, a great post, Mack!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-67468145485641548372008-06-17T12:58:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:58:00.000-05:00The Karma feature in Plurk is kind of "cute", but ...The Karma feature in Plurk is kind of "cute", but I can see why it inspires abuse. It reminds me of how people abuse LinkedIn Questions by using it as a promotion tool. In short, whenever there is the opportunity for promotion, there will be a certain group of people that will use it - even if it is in poor taste - i.e. handing out business cards at a funeral.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-48900598556243784292008-06-17T12:57:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:57:00.000-05:00Good points all, and thanks for commenting! Really...Good points all, and thanks for commenting! Really I'm not sure that there IS a 'one-size-fits-all' answer.<BR/><BR/>But I think it's more important to get the conversation started now while Plurk is still smart, and still receptive to feedback from the community. As we saw recently with Twitter, attention from a small startup doesn't scale very well when the userbase is a few million, versus the few thousand that Plurk supposedly has now.Mack Collierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02723628321171539590noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-75072797174239194922008-06-17T12:53:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:53:00.000-05:00I really believe that a public reward system will ...I really believe that a public reward system will bring the best and worst out of competitive people. The hope is that the system can not be easily manipulated, and if it is, then the community and/or community managers will punish the behavior. A good starts is the way we have been unfollowing people this week, and leaving the people that truly add value to our network to remain in it.<BR/><BR/>Plurk's algorithm could be improved, but beyond that, the rewards for top contributors should be more than a few smileys. Plurk should leverage its early evangelists and begin to form a user advisory board or influencer program.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-44328921723559105082008-06-17T12:40:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:40:00.000-05:00Excellent post, Mack. I think your best question i...Excellent post, Mack. I think your best question is whether the focus upon the individual points in the form of karma will undermine the development of a community in which we all work to help each other. <BR/><BR/>My thinking is that the concept of karma is "good" but should drop only with negativity, sarcasm, "hating", etc. Of course, that would be impossible to monitor.Frank Conrad Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18039794602234879947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-90707253892455613492008-06-17T12:31:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:31:00.000-05:00For what it's worth, Mixx has had a similar Karma ...For what it's worth, Mixx has had a similar Karma score for participation, and additional functionality when your karma reaches a certain amount, and people still don't comment much on Mixx.katfrenchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03549111647775203098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-22153530206562811052008-06-17T12:29:00.001-05:002008-06-17T12:29:00.001-05:00I suspect the drive to pad karma will fall off for...I suspect the drive to pad karma will fall off for individuals as they realize it's more work than it's worth.<BR/><BR/>However, I completely see your point. It's always useful to reflect on the behavior your policies encourage.<BR/><BR/>Plurk is a mixed bag for me. I would love to toggle between the threaded discussions, as it has now, and a simpler interface such as Twitter has now.<BR/><BR/>On the one hand, Plurk allows you to keep track of conversations, but on the other hand, it's more difficult to scan.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-28844529491445087062008-06-17T12:29:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:29:00.000-05:00I think forcing community involvement typically ha...I think forcing community involvement typically has an initial positive impact, but eventually frustrates participants who are there for authentic purposes. People love being popular, but as you said, quality begins to suffer. Great post!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13688020408748576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24784219.post-42373481020082600712008-06-17T12:27:00.000-05:002008-06-17T12:27:00.000-05:00as with all rewards and recognition care has to be...as with all rewards and recognition care has to be taken to reward the "right" behavior. If you reward mindless spam you will get mindless spam. If you reward contribution to the community you will get contribution to the community. Take a look at these two articles about yelp:<BR/>http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/05/12/why-yelp-works/<BR/>http://experiencecurve.com/archives/why-social-media-kills-the-competition-yelpcom-case<BR/><BR/>It's all about rewards and recognition. <BR/><BR/>One thing I don't think many people get is that when you are building a community you are the most passionate members become pseudo employees and therefore beyond consumer motivation you need to look at employee motivation, and we're not talking money here, we're talking things like autonomy and recognition, things like that.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com